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>The Catholic Encyclopaedia fails to mention the Bruno was burnt to death, Actually, it does mention that: ``he was finally condemned (January, 1600), handed over to the secular power (8 February), and burned at the stake in the Campo dei Fiori in Rome (17 February).'' http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/03016a.htm > a cruel death for heretical views. And it says it was for heretical views: ``Bruno was not condemned for his defence of the Copernican system of astronomy, nor for his doctrine of the plurality of inhabited worlds, but for his theological errors, among which were the following: that Christ was not God but merely an unusually skilful magician, that the Holy Ghost is the soul of the world, that the Devil will be saved, etc.'' > Bruno is the Church's most difficult explanation. Then I guess we've wandered far enough down this side road and can get back to the question at hand of survivals of the Templars. There seem to be three broad groups of claimed survivals: 1) Ones that base their claims on the Transmission of Larmenius. Others have raised many cogent reasons why that document is probably not what it purports to be. And there has been one suggestion of how possibly it could be. That discussion I leave to others. 2) Then there are survivals based on verifiable contemporary documents, such as papal bulls and Portuguese and Aragonese court documents. In particular, both the Catholic Encyclopedia and John Robinson's book Dungeon, Fire, and Sword cite a papal bull of 1319. 3) Then there is speculation about what Templars would likely have done in the situation they found themselves in. There may well be other claims, but these are the ones I've seen mentioned recently in this list. I have been pursuing only (2). As it happens, the Vatican has provided further historical information about the Order of Christ in Portugal, including the details that the order was originally elective (as had been the Templars), and that the papacy regarded it as a religious military foundation. A Portuguese king had to petition the pope to make his son Grand Master. That son was the infante Dom Enrique, commonly known as Henry the Navigator. http://www.chivalricorders.org/vatican/christ.htm The Vatican has also made available online the text of the Bull Ad ea ex quibus of Pope John XXII, given at Avignon 14/15 March 1319: http://www.chivalricorders.org/vatican/chrstbll.htm Latin scholars among us: translation, please. John S. Quarterman <jsq@quarterman.org>