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Dear friends, My apologies for the delay in responsing to this topic, but have only just returned from Italy. It saddens me greatly that certain members of this list view any reminder of the values this present conflict is supposedly protecting, i.e. the right to a fair trial, the preumption of innocence, the need for proof before convicyion etc, only originate from 'anti-Americanism or socialism'. I was under the mistaken and obviously erroneous belief that thesae are the very values enshrined i the United States Constitution and applicabhle in principle to all free men and women.Obviously I was wrong. Earlier in this debate I got the distinct smell of an unfortunatly widespread attitude of 'my country right or wrong'. Well for me as an individual with a conscience who wore his country's unform for many years, that sort of blind patriotism is never enopugh. If that is to be the ruling attitude of the moment then I shall make my position crystal clear - I would far rather betray my country than my friend, and, if push comes to shove, I would rather betray my friend than my principles. Freedom for all men and Justice under the law are the blessed foundations of the western way of life and at present are put under far greater threat by our blind patriots whose knee-jerk reaction supports military-style tribunals, than by Bin Laden. Best wishes Tim [ This is the Sinclair family discussion list, sinclair@quarterman.org [ To get off or on the list, see http://sinclair.quarterman.org/list.html