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My understanding this is the Sinclair Family discussion group. We discuss. "discussion noun. argue about, confer about, consider, consult about, debate, deliberate, examine, put heads together about, speak about, talk about, thrash out, weigh the pros and cons of, write about. discussion argument, literary colloquy, confabulation, conference, consideration, consultation, conversation, debate, deliberation, dialogue, discourse, examination, exchange of views, powwow, symposium, talk." Copywrite Oxford University 2001. What great input we have had. Look at Joe Erks reasonable. I do not agree with some of his conclusions, but he stands his ground well. Come let us reason together. Tim Wallace-Murphy calls for "Reason, Justice and Truth" but he states that those ideals "have rarely been able to impinge on prejudice, be it racial, religious, nationalistic or class based" We must make the principles reason justice and truth meaningful. We stand at a crossroads of history. America is envied by many as the biggest boy on the block it happens. President George W. Bush shot from the hip. Colin Powell and George Bush called for War Crimes. Both have now changed their tune. In the light of the depraved, wicked and immoral act of 11 September emotion compelled us all to call for vengeance. Maybe Bush and Powell read the Sinclair family discussion group and realised that the answer to a degenerate, evil crime was not another crime. The group must be part of our International Strategy. Perhaps after the feelings of grief and outrage calmed they came to the realisation that losing America values, tearing up the world's oldest written Constitution with secret trials and star chamber detention was victory to the evil ones. America is a great Republic. America is not a democracy. It is a republic. The danger is that in defeating terrorism you lose the basic values that America stands for. No one should follow the leader blindly. The Germans followed Hitler. In Jan., 1933, when Adolph Hitler became chancellor of Germany he had no majority. New elections were called for 5 March. On 27 Feb. 1933, fire destroyed part of the Reichstag building. Hitler accused at once the Communists of having set the fire. President von Hindenburg proclaimed a state of emergency and issued decrees suspending among other thing Freedom of speech and permitting detention without charge on the basis people's name's alone. The elections gave a bare majority of seats to Hitler's National Socialists and their allies, the German Nationalists. On 23 Mar. the Enabling Act, which gave the government, dictatorial powers. Only the Social Democrats dissented. In the Reichstag fire trial of 1933, a Dutchman named Marinus van der Lubbe was charged with having set the fire as part of a Communist plot. Communist leaders, including Georgi Dimitrov, were charged with complicity. Van der Lubbe was sentenced to death; the others were found not guilty. In 1934. van der Lubbe was probably guilty. The 11 September is a day that will go down in disgrace. We can not and should not lose the company of free men to defeat any enemy however vile and repulsive. Britain has stood with America, French and Polish troops are in Afghanistan. bin Laden is not the problem, he is the result of the problem. I would love to hear more ideas and thought of how to solve this problem. I would like to know to deal with this terror without destroying our values. How do free men live in open societies and guard themselves against criminals and misguided beasts? Our national interest may have to be subverted to a greater good. The light of liberty emanating from American shores can not and should be extinguished. The law must be equal for every man. America must stand strong and protect, herself, her values and her dreams. It is the duty and obligation of every free man to keep his mind and his mouth open. Sinclair ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carter, Judy G (Judy)" <jhouck@avaya.com> To: <sinclair@quarterman.org> Sent: Monday, December 03, 2001 7:03 PM Subject: RE: Prince Henry > Ok, I think we're all thru aurging for now...We're just doing like most [ This is the Sinclair family discussion list, sinclair@quarterman.org [ To get off or on the list, see http://sinclair.quarterman.org/list.html